A violation of boundaries is never okay.
by Kyeli on February 1st, 2010 @ 9:30 am in
Connection Paradigm
Over the weekend, we went to a good friend’s birthday party. It was a huge get-together, filled with many people from many walks of life.
One of the many people was a guy I’ve met before through a totally unrelated group. This guy and I had a brief conversation, he made me uncomfortable, and I moved on to talk to people who didn’t make me uncomfortable. I later found out that he’s something of a sexual troll – he gets involved in groups and then tries to make it with as many of the women as possible without anyone finding out. He’s not very good at the no one finding out part, but seems to be fairly successful at the other part. But he’s creepy and sleazy and makes me incredibly uncomfortable.
Seeing him at the party this weekend was pretty hard. I was pleasant to him, because I’m not one to make a scene at a big party. I tried to shake his hand, but he wrestled it into a hug and I found myself hugging him and being really uncomfortable with it.
Later, he was blocking the only path back to my table and the safety of Pace and our friends. I stood and waited for him to move for two or three minutes, but it became obvious that he was oblivious to my plight, so I walked up and said, “Excuse me, I need to get by.”
He shifted – barely – and said, “Be my guest.”
I took a deep breath and started to squeeze past him. I’d barely taken two steps when he stepped toward me, closing off the tiny distance between us and throwing me off balance. I stumbled and kind of bumped into him and instinctively apologized. He grinned a very leering grin and said (in a sleazy supposed-to-be-sexy tone), “Oooh, no problem. You can get even closer than that,” and started to wrap his arms around me to pull me to him.
I just about all-out panicked. I threw up my hands and said, “Uh, no thanks,” and darted past him as fast as possible and scrambled back to my chair. He attempted to make eye contact with me some ten times or more throughout the rest of the party til I got too uncomfortable to stay there any longer, and we left.
In the car, recounting the tale to Pace, she said, “Woah, any time something like that happens, you can tell me and I will punch him in the face right away.”
I giggled, but then I got mad. This guy violated my physical and emotional boundaries, and I didn’t stick up for myself. I let it go and squeaked by and ran off because I didn’t want to cause a scene at a friend’s party – but my friends would want me to defend myself if I needed defending!
Now, it wasn’t as bad as it could’ve been. I did emit a weak no and stepped back. There was a time when I would have let him wrap his arms around me and then I would have been silently flipping the fuck out. At least I didn’t do that.
But I still let him get far too close for my comfort. I felt violated. I felt afraid and slightly ashamed. I didn’t even tell Pace til hours later, when we’d left the party – I wasn’t comfortable talking about it until then. I was so upset I was nearly shaking, and I kept it a secret because I felt guilty and afraid.
This is the kind of behavior that leads to rape.
We spend most of our lives learning to sit down and shut up. Learning to demur and take the blame. Learning not to defend ourselves even when directly threatened. Learning that fierce equals violence and violence is bad.
If I’d've hauled off and decked this creep, he could have pressed charges on me – and “he made me feel uncomfortable and violated my boundaries” isn’t seen as a defense.
If I had said something more like, “Dude, I’m gay,” I could have passed off his unwanted overtures as inappropriate – since he knows I’m gay, having been previously informed of such.
If I had said something like, “Back off. You’re making me uncomfortable,” I would have gotten my point very clearly across and probably wouldn’t have had to deal with him making furtive attempts at eye contact for the rest of the party.
But all I could manage was a meek squeak and darting away as fast as possible.
I’m frustrated by that. I’m afraid for myself, because in different circumstances, that could have gone much, much worse.
This is why we talk about fierceness. This is why I write about being raped, why I talk about being violated, why I shine lights into the darkness of my past experiences.
We are sacred. Our boundaries are sacred. Our experiences are sacred. Talking about our experiences, good or bad, brings that light to the darkness. It brings us together when we feel the most alone – because we are never alone. When you stand up for yourself, you stand with all the power of all the people in your community.
Because we’re taught to be meek, because we’re made to feel ashamed, because we often believe we are alone, the only cure is being open, fierce, and banding together to learn and teach and shout from rooftops: regardless of the circumstances, it is never okay for anyone to violate any boundary we hold.
No related posts.
Have you read the Freak Revolution Manifesto? It tells the story of why there is so much hurt and sadness in the world, and how we can heal through connection.
19 Comments!
#2 Posted by 
Heather Freeman on February 1st, 2010 12:16 pm | link
That’s awful, Kyeli, I’m so sorry.
But I don’t think you should get down on yourself for not being able to do more to defend yourself. You said yourself that you put up a stronger fight than you would have in the past, and in the future I know you’ll be able to do more still.
And saying “this is the kind of stuff that leads to rape” – you’re right, BUT, huge, screaming BUT, that’s perilously close to saying that the woman who doesn’t fight is to blame for getting raped. The responsibility for this lies 100% with the person violating another person’s boundaries. Boundary-violators won’t stop because more women fight back – they’ll just find more vulnerable women to target. It will only stop when bystanders stop looking the other way when a woman is threatened; when society as a whole looks at such behavior with the disgust and revulsion it deserves.
You say this guy isn’t very good at keeping his predation secret. Why, then, has he not been shunned by the community as a whole? Why are there not a dozen people watching him carefully to slap him down the moment he gets out of line, so that that weight does not rest solely on the shoulders of the person he’s after?
Heather Freeman´s last blog ..Waiting 
#3 Posted by 
Sheila on February 1st, 2010 12:26 pm | link
Urgh, I hate having to deal with that sort of thing.
Physically decking him would not have been good, yes, but I’ve found that as a last resort screaming “LEAVE ME THE FUCK ALONE” (or variations thereof) will work wonders. (I’m not being flip–I’ve actually done this to guys who pressed me too hard.) Before reaching that point, however, a good withering remark will often work to dissuade most potential Gropy McGropersons. (ex. “I don’t want to be your guest, I want you to get the hell out of the way so I can get through. Move your ass.”)
No matter what you do, if you assert your boundaries around guys like that, they’ll whine that you’re not being nice, so you might as well go all the way. He was a jerk first and you were under no obligation to put up with it.
Sheila´s last blog ..Word Art: Star Light Star Bright
#4 Posted by 
Valerie M on February 1st, 2010 12:50 pm | link
I’ve been reading a lot about how people, especially women, fail to define exactly what their boundaries are (or at least, they fail to enforce those boundaries) and that’s why they fluster through life so much. Not just when it comes to rape, but everything in general.
I always thought I had very strong boundaries until recently, I realized they aren’t that strong at all in a lot of areas in my life. One trick that has been working for me is to define what I don’t want and what I won’t do. It’s far easier to enforce what you DON’T want than it is to define what you do want. We all know what we don’t want, right?
As for the guy in your story, I’ve had something similar happen. Some guy who was much older than me got far too comfortable and I wasn’t having it. Let’s just say my boundaries are pretty strong in that aspect!
Valerie M´s last blog ..Racism & discrimination: Seeing beyond the past and aiming for respect instead
#5 Posted by 
Jennifer "Scraps" Walker on February 1st, 2010 1:20 pm | link
I’m actually not convinced that a polite refusal of his “charms” would have done much good. He sounds like a first class toad and they are really good at spinning their slime no matter what the rebuttal–I think I’ve met his long-lost cousin a time or two.
Kudos for standing up, even a little. Each step is a step in the right direction.
Jennifer “Scraps” Walker´s last blog ..On the Subject of Picky Eaters
#6 Posted by 
Nathalie Lussier on February 1st, 2010 1:21 pm | link
Ohmigosh, so sorry to hear of your icky experience! And the worst thing? I can relate. I’ve had experiences where I didn’t feel comfortable but I sucked it up because we’re taught to be the good little girls who don’t make a fuss. I don’t have to deal with this kind of stuff anymore since I try to avoid these types of situations.
Though honestly there was far too much sleaze for my taste in my 90% male university program, and maybe that’s why I choose to stay away from a lot of those people. I think once people get to know you and understand where your boundaries are, it’s much easier. That’s why this kind of stuff doesn’t happen with friends.
Still, very unpleasant! ;_;
Nathalie Lussier´s last blog ..Mindful Monday: Dreamboard Edition
#7 Posted by 
Kyeli on February 1st, 2010 1:24 pm | link
@Heather: And saying “this is the kind of stuff that leads to rape” – you’re right, BUT, huge, screaming BUT, that’s perilously close to saying that the woman who doesn’t fight is to blame for getting raped. The responsibility for this lies 100% with the person violating another person’s boundaries.
What I meant was, not standing up for ourselves is the kind of behavior that makes us easy targets for rape – because rapists know most women won’t fight back much, and because we don’t often talk about our experiences, which means a rapist has a frighteningly high chance of getting away with it.
Thank you for pointing out the disparity – that was certainly not my intentioned meaning.
#8 Posted by 
Michelle on February 2nd, 2010 12:07 am | link
It’s so frustrating, because we’re taught as women that someone violating our boundaries is MUCH less important than ‘keeping the peace’ (whatever that means) as a whole. Just managing to get your (proverbial you, not Kyeli you!) head around that and say “Wait, no, MY boundaries are important, because what use is keeping the peace if I’m not being respected?” is a huge huge deal and hard to do. Hell, it’s something that I know, and while I think I probably would have got pretty snotty with McSleazy, I wouldn’t have done it too loudly for fear of making a scene.
Michelle´s last blog ..Marvelous Monday!
#9 Posted by 
Tracy on February 2nd, 2010 9:55 am | link
Kyeli, all good points, and kudos for publicly addressing this issue. I just want to point out that a “Dude, I’m gay” response would have missed the mark (in terms of a strong message about boundaries), because this guy’s behavior was *globally* unacceptable. What he was doing was not okay even if the intended target had been heterosexual (i.e. assumed to be receptive to male attention). “I’m gay” in this context is equivalent to “I’m excused from truly confronting this behavior.”
And I’m sure you get this already–I just felt that it needed to be explicitly stated.
I also want to say that boundary-setting (in the moment, and reviewing circumstances after the fact) is HARD WORK and it requires a lot of compassion for ourselves. I have often kicked myself for having taken the easy way out. But it’s possible to forgive ourselves for a knee-jerk self-protective response. Your processing of this experience has changed the way you’ll react in the future, and your sharing of this experience on your blog will also change others’ ideas about how and why to respond.
Tracy´s last blog ..Reflection: Self-Care for Artists
#10 Posted by 
Karilee on February 2nd, 2010 11:36 am | link
Ick, creepy guy. As Heather said, your community could be more proactive in shunning this guy. One of the blessings of my online gaming guild is fierce women members… and men who are just as fierce if they’re treated badly. Yet I do understand how programmed we are to put up with this stuff and “not make a fuss”. Looking back now to how I would have reacted a couple of decades ago, if I were in your shoes, makes me shake my head.
Another word I like is “ferocious”. I got that from Pete Michaud. One of the reasons I started reading Pete Michaud’s blog, which I now enjoy tremendously, was because he commented that he surrounds himself with ferocious women.
Karilee´s last blog ..3 Reasons to Build Your WordPress Blog Today
#11 Posted by 
Megan M. on February 2nd, 2010 3:38 pm | link
If I had said something like, “Back off. You’re making me uncomfortable,” I would have gotten my point very clearly across and probably wouldn’t have had to deal with him making furtive attempts at eye contact for the rest of the party.
I really like this take — and I really like that you went through a couple of options including this one. I’ve gone to the extent of repeating over and over to myself, “Sorry, I’m not comfortable with that,” to make it more likely that I would actually say it if a situation came up. I really like the fierce “Back off. You’re making me uncomfortable.” I will definitely use it. It’s killer.
Good vibes, lady.
Megan M.´s last blog ..Phonetic Scrabble
#12 Posted by 
Hayden Tompkins on February 2nd, 2010 10:44 pm | link
“I later found out that he’s something of a sexual troll – he gets involved in groups and then tries to make it with as many of the women as possible without anyone finding out.”
UGH. UGH!!
First of all, ew. Second of all, what you’ve described is a sexual predator. And what makes me so angry about all of this, aside from the fact that you had to deal with this, is that I’ve done the same thing…not spoken up when I should have. Not set boundaries when I needed to. Not been willing to YELL no matter how it ‘makes me look’.
Thank you for writing about this.
Meanwhile, WHY IS THIS SEXUAL PREDATOR STILL GETTING INVITED TO PARTIES?
#13 Posted by 
scwizard on February 3rd, 2010 2:29 am | link
But all I could manage was a meek squeak and darting away as fast as possible.
It’s a tough battle against yourself.
I heard from one girl that martial arts helped her with this sort of thing, because it becomes a gut reaction. Instead of having to cut through all the inner gunk that makes standing up for yourself so difficult, it’s just a matter of reflexively counter attacking when someone attacks you, since you’ve practiced doing it so many times.
If tons and tons of time, your practice partner has run at you, and you’ve thrown them, then when someone runs at you in real life, you throw them, because that’s what you’ve practiced doing.
That’s a shortcut. Cutting through the inner gunk may be more difficult, but it might also be more rewarding. Also important to note that the two aren’t mutually exclusive paths.
scwizard´s last blog ..D&D!
#14 Posted by Item! Trust. Crankiness. Measuring cups. | cuinlalaland on February 17th, 2010 8:05 am | link
[...] Kyeli wrote about how violating boundaries is never okay. [...]
#15 Posted by 
Krin on February 17th, 2010 11:43 am | link
Thankyou, this echoes so closely what I have been dealing with for the past 10 years, as well as directly struggling with in the last year as I embarked on what is hopefully a lifeling relationship.
The only two counselling sessions I have ever had both spoke about my inability to set boundaries. I thought it was just my special head that allowed this to happen. It’s good to know it isn’t.
The issue is coming up again, most recently in the last week, and this post may help me to communicate my past to the people who need to know.
Krin´s last blog ..Year of the Tiger. pt 1
#16 Posted by 
Sarah on February 17th, 2010 3:56 pm | link
You are totally right; bravo.
The way that this gets hard for me is in boundaries that aren’t about my physical body. Does “I need you to do/not do X so that I will feel safe” count as a reasonable request when X is, say “not yell at me?” What do I do when someone with whom I have a treasured relationship — a friend, a family member, a partner — cannot or will not respect that? What about when our needs honestly conflict? How do I balance “I understand that your intention is not to violate my boundaries” with “I have explained to you that the effect of that behavior is to violate my boundaries?”
Good stuff to think about. Thank you.
#17 Posted by 
Christina on February 18th, 2010 8:42 am | link
Great work taking care of your boundaries
There’s a piece of this from a boundary point of view that I think is important. The kind of person/behavior you’re describing is oriented on the group, not the individual. Even though the hookups may be one-on-one the ubiquitous focus makes it a group dynamic. It’s been my experience that ONLY embarrassing people like this in front of the group and bringing the hidden dynamic to the light really works. Part of the problem is the group rules about politeness and appropriateness.
That’s not your job as the person on the spot, but something to think about. Perhaps a role for the host(s) of one of many the parties where this has happened?
#18 Posted by 
Vicki Jean on February 18th, 2010 12:37 pm | link
Two simple words: BACK OFF! Would have been suffiecient. No explanation would be necessary, such as you stated, “You are making me uncomfortable.” That just gives them a feeling of being in charge, which is what they want, and enjoy the most. Sorry that happened to you but can tell by your testimony, it will never happen again.
I struggled with boundaries for years because I was raised to be the nice girl as well. I was violated so many times in so many different ways. I am now consider a tough soul, (to put it in a nice way) but I don’t care. It’s better than feeling afraid and helpless. I wish you all the best for any future encounters. I’m sure you will know how to handle it now. Don’t know you, but am sending a hug! Love, Vicki Jean
Vicki Jean´s last blog ..Haiti Earthquake Survivor
#19 Posted by 
Laura on February 18th, 2010 9:47 pm | link
I’m really happy to see you talking about this, it’s something that I struggle with big time.
For me it often happens with hugs – I’ll give someone a half hug and I get the “c’mon that’s the best you can do?”. Then I hug them in a way that makes me totally uncomfortable because I’m afraid to speak up and cause a scene.
Laura´s last blog ..Marketing for Shy People: How Social Media Can Help
#1 Posted by
James Schipper on February 1st, 2010 10:23 am | link
Monkey steals the peach. Google that. :-)
Glad you know to stand up for yourself. You deserve that.
James Schipper´s last blog ..Crush It! Work Your Face Off with Gary Vaynerchuk